Ka Xiong：这部影片将向我们的祖母致敬

Ka Xiong是一名生活和工作于老挝琅勃拉邦的摄影师。他的摄影作品《精神世界》曾在琅勃拉邦国际双年展、巴黎摄影展、世界图像双年展展出。他也曾作为湄公河流域五国五位年轻摄影师之一参加2012年的金边摄影节。除了摄影，他也是一位新兴的电影制作人，曾获得老挝电影基金会和琅勃拉邦电影节的资助，制作了剧情短片《改变的旋律》。并参加过包括琅勃拉邦电影节研讨会、在河内举行的海洋纪录片制作人研讨会等国际会议。同时，他创办了琅勃拉邦MALAO工作室，致力于支持对摄影、电影、当代艺术和音乐感兴趣的老挝年轻人进行创作。

2020年，Ka Xiong加入了“澜湄之眼”澜湄四国少数民族影像技术人才培训计划，期间制作了纪录片《祖母的世界》。试图通过记录祖母的生活和记忆，来展示老挝北部山区苗族村落的文化侧影。

“在过去的日子里，村民们住在远离城市、学校和医院的村庄。这些社区不得不自食其力，用传统草药来对抗疼痛和疾病。情况正在发生变化。如今，几乎每个村庄都有一所小学，而且通往公路和医院的道路也更好了。草药仍在使用，但正在失去其重要性。”对作为苗族人的卡雄来说，这种传统草药的治疗方式是一种宝贵的生活财富，同时也反映着苗族人与自然环境的关系，以及生活方式的变迁。

如今，Ka Xiong的87岁祖母与她的儿子一起住在老挝北部山区的隆兰村，这是琅勃拉邦省为数不多的几乎没有变化的苗族村落之一。她是一位温柔体贴的母亲，对于家庭和村庄来说都很重要。同时，她从父辈那里掌握了丰富的苗族草药知识，并将这些知识一代一代地传授下去。但如今她的年纪越来越大，听觉开始模糊，也开始忘记一些事情。

Ka Xiong不认为这是一部“关于苗族的影片”，而是一部“关于一位特别的苗族女性的影片，而这位女性恰好是我的祖母。”他说道，“这部影片将向我们的祖母致敬。她对我们的生活意义重大。我们想抓紧时间，给她做一个人物纪录片。趁着现在她还和我们在一起，还能说话。同时，这部影片也是对苗族生活方式的纪念，这种生活方式在很多代人中没有改变，但现在正在消失。”

Q&A:

Q：你是怎样开始接触影像工作的？

A：读中学时我就喜欢拍照片。14岁时我得到了第一台模拟相机。那时候，拍照片是很贵的。我得小心对待买来的胶片。只有在想清楚时才按下快门。那时我已经是某种程度上的专业人士了：人们付钱让我给他们拍照。几乎总是肖像照或者家庭合影。但这让我有了一些收入，也使我能够拍摄想拍摄的照片。

2006年，我搬到琅勃拉邦读高中和大学，图书馆免费为学生提供培训和租用数码相机。那是非常奇妙的经历。我可以随时按快门，如果是不喜欢的照片就可以删除，也可以在图书馆的电脑上看我所有的照片。

也会有一些来自国外的专业摄影师志愿来图书馆分享他们的摄影知识，我一次都没有错过。

2010年，我发现了制作视频的乐趣，也是在图书馆。更令人兴奋的是，能学习如何讲故事，如何表现动作，如何创造声音等等。

大学毕业后，我本该是一名英语教师。但我确信我真正要做的是拍摄电影和照片。我选择了这个职业。我参加了所有能让我参加的老挝和国外的工作坊，并作为荷兰专业电影制作人兼摄影师阿德里•伯杰（Adri Berger）的学徒兼助理工作了两年。后来，我和我非常钦佩的保罗·韦格（Paul Wager）合作了很多。

Q：你认为一部好的纪录片应该是什么样子？请举例说明。

A：我认为一部好的纪录片应该尽可能简单，讲述应该被讲述的事。纪录片应该要能被人理解，也应该是动人的。即使我们不知道一些语言，但影片中的画面也应该让人保持兴趣。

我最喜欢的纪录片之一是露西·沃克（Lucy Walker）的《垃圾场（Waste Land）》。那是一部很感人的电影。让我可以与主人公产生连接，我也认为我可以与导演自己连接起来，理解为什么这部电影必须被制作出来，以及怎么制作。

Q：你如何看待老挝的纪录片行业？

A：老挝有纪录片，也有剧情片，但还不足以成为产业。我相信这个国家有很多人才，和很多不为人知的故事。现在，如果想做一个作品，是很难找到预算的。但我们正在努力，每年都会有更多的影片出现。

老挝人对老挝剧情片很感兴趣，但这里只有很少的制作能力和资金。

Q：你在参加“澜湄之眼”计划期间为什么选择拍摄一部关于祖母的影片？这次制作过程对你自己有怎样的影响？

A：第一个原因是祖母值得被拍成一部人物纪录片。她的生活中充满了悲伤、戏剧、压力和失望。还有温暖的爱、快乐和音乐。我们苗族社区的许多人都与她相关。她对苗族传统草药的了解也很吸引人。

我们的祖母过去是、现在仍是我和我表弟布恩索·托尔（Bounsoo Thor）生活中的重要人物。所以我们一起制作这个影片。有时是拍摄，有时是采访。这部影片讲述的是祖母和她的孩子们——我们，她的孙子们，以及我们和她的关系。对我来说这是我第一次不仅作为一个观察者和拍摄者，而是一个真正的参与者，我在电影中也成为可见的。

这是一个需要时间和大量即兴发挥的影片。我很感激我们可以在“澜湄之眼”的框架里开始。这是一个正在进行的工作，还有很多事情要做。与其它项目不同的是，我不必去认识拍摄的人。因为我们已经非常了解我们的祖母，她也非常了解我们。我认为我们拍摄和剪辑的素材都表明了这一点。

我的体会是，如果你熟悉你的主角，以及所拍摄的人或社区，同时他们也了解你和你作为电影制作人的生活，他们就会信任你。所有事都进行得会更快、更顺利。这使我们节省了预算，并且给我们拍摄更多素材的空间。

Q：在制作这部纪录片的过程中，你是否遇到一些难题？如何解决？

A：就在我们开始拍摄之前的一周，祖母出了车祸。我们不得不等到她康复之后再开始。然后她又摔倒了，情况变得更糟了。我原本做的计划不得不改变很多。于是我们密切地关注着情况，看看什么时候是最好的时机，能溜回去拍摄她。祖母的病让她要求举行一个仪式来帮助康复。那场仪式在清晨的准备工作是这部影片中的精彩素材。有时候，意想不到的事会发生在你想讲述的故事中。

Q：你自己关于苗族的草药有什么样的记忆？

A：我有很多相关的记忆。我妈妈从祖母那里学过，所以我小时候也经历过很多草药的治疗。当我的孩子们发烧时，我也知道该给他们吃什么药。我家房子周围有一篮子草药。我也很清楚什么时候该把他们送到医院去。

Q：为什么影片中巫师的话语没有加以翻译呢？

A：因为巫师的大部分话语我也听不懂。它不是我们世界的语言。只有巫师，那些花时间学习与鬼神打交道的人才明白那些话语的意思。

Ka Xiong is a photographer and emerging filmmaker in Luang Prabang, Laos. His

work SPIRIT WORLD is shown in 2nd Biennale Internationale de l’image de Luang Prabang 2010 and Photoquai 2011 in Paris, 3rd Biennale des Images du Monde. He was selected as one of the five young photographers in five countries along the Mekong River to exhibit

at Phnom Penh Photo Festival in December 2012. As a filmmaker, Ka Xiong has attended PSA workshops in Vientiane, Film Festival workshops in Luang Prabang, and a workshop for SEA documentary filmmakers in Hanoi, Vietnam, in June 2015. He was funded by the Lao Film Fund and Luang Prabang Film Festival to produce his short fiction film Melody of Change. Ka Xiong is also the founder of MALAO Studios in Luang Prabang, Laos. The studio tries to support young Laos people who are interested in photography, film, contemporary art, and music.

In 2020, Ka Xiong joined Lancang-Mekong Vision: Minority Anthropological Video Fusion media Production program (LMV program), in which he made a documentary Grandma’s World. By recording his grandma's life and memory, he tries to show the cultural profile of Hmong villages in northern Laos.

“In the old days, the villagers in villages lived in the countryside far from the city, schools, and hospitals. The community had to fend for itself and used traditional herbs against illness and pain. Nowadays things are changing. Nearly every village has a primary school and much easier access to roads and hospitals. Herbs are still used, but are losing their importance.” For Ka Xiong, a Miao nationality, this traditional herbal medicine treatment is a precious wealth of life. It also reflects the relationship between the Hmong people and the natural environment, as well as the changes in their lifestyle.

Nowadays, Ka Xiong’s 87-year-old grandma is living with his uncle in Longlan village, one of the few nearly unchanged Hmong villages in Luang Prabang Province. She always has been the warm and caring mother, who is important in her family and in the villages she has lived in. She has a great knowledge of local herbs and passes that on to the community and her family. She learned it from her grandparents and her parents. But she is getting old and starts to forget things now.

Ka Xiong thinks this film will not be about the Hmong, it will be about a special and individual Hmong lady, who happens to be his own grandma. He said, “This film will be an homage to our grandma who meant so much in our lives. We want to seize time and make a small portrait of her now she is still with us and able to talk. The film is also a memento for the Hmong way of life that has stayed unchanged for many generations but is disappearing now.”

Q&A:

How did you start to work on images and documentaries?

I became fond of taking photos when I was in secondary school. I got my first analog camera at 14 years old. It was very expensive to take photos. I had to be very careful with the films I bought. I will take one shot only if I wanted to take a picture. I had been a kind of professional already then. People paid me to have their photos taken. Though nearly always portraits and family photos, it brought me some money to make the pictures I wanted to make.

In 2006, I moved to the city for high school and later went to the University of Luang Prabang. At the library, it offers students training sessions and loans of a digital camera for a few days for free. That was a very, very amazing experience. I could press the shutter whenever I wanted and if I didn’t like I just delete it. I could review all my photos on the computer in the library. Professional photographers from abroad often volunteered to share their knowledge about photography at the Library. I never missed any chance.

In 2010, I discovered the joy of video making, also at my Library. It was even more exciting to learn the basics of how to tell a story, how to play with movement, and how to create sound...

After I graduated from university, I was meant to become an English teacher. But I was sure that what I really needed to do is to make films and photos. So I chose that profession. I attended all workshops in Laos and abroad that let me in, and I worked for two years full time as an apprentice/assistant to Adri Berger, who is a dutch professional filmmaker/photographer. Later, I have worked a lot with Paul Wager, an Australian photographer who now lives in Luang Prabang. He inspired me the most.

What do you think a good documentary should look like? Please give some examples of your favorite documentaries and tell us why.

I think a good documentary should be as simple as possible. It should tell what it has to tell. People must be able to relate to the documentary. It also should reach their feelings. The images in the film should keep you interested even when you do not know the language you hear or read.

One of my favorite documentaries is Waste Land directed by Lucy Walker. It’s a very touching film. I can relate to the protagonists and I think I can relate to the filmmaker herself about why and how this film had to be made.

What do you think of the documentary industry in Laos?

There are documentaries made in Laos, also fiction films. But that is not enough to call it an industry. I am sure there are a lot of talents in the country and a lot of untold stories. For now, if you want to produce it is hard to finance it. But we are working on it and you will see more every year.

Lao people are interested in Lao fiction films, but there is only a small capacity and money to produce them.

Why did you choose to make a film about your grandma during the LMV program? How did the process of filmmaking this time affect you?

The first reason is grandma deserves a portrait. There was sadness, drama, stress, and disappointment in her life, but also warm love, good fun, and musical moments. Many of us in the Hmong community can relate to it. Her knowledge of Hmong traditional herbs is fascinating.

Our grandma was and still is an important person in my life and that of my cousin Bounsoo Thor. We work together on the project. Sometimes filming, sometimes interviewing. The film is about her but also about her relationship with her children and us—her grandchildren. For me, it is the first time I am not only the observing and directing filmmaker but also a participant, a visible person in my film.

It is a project that takes time and much improvisation. I am grateful that we could start within the LMV framework. It is a work in progress. There is still a lot to come. Different from other projects I did not have to get acquainted with the people I film. We know our grandma very well and she also knows us very well. I think the material we shot and edited until now shows that.

I learned that if you know your protagonists, the people, and the community you will film, meanwhile, if they know you and your life as a filmmaker, they trust you. The process will go a lot faster and smoother. That keeps our budget low and gives us space to film and add new material.

Did you encounter any difficulties during the production of this documentary? How did you solve the difficulties in the end?

Grandma had an accident just one week before we started to film. We had to wait until she recovered. She fell again and it got worse. I had made some plans but had to change a lot.

We followed the situation closely to see when the best time would be to sneak in and film her. Her illness made her ask for a ceremony to help her recover. The early morning preparation of that ceremony proved to be wonderful material for the film. Sometimes in situations like this unexpected things happen that fit well in the story that you want to tell.

Can you share some of your memories about traditional herbs?

Sure, I have a lot of memories. My mom learned from my grandma and I got a lot of herbal treatment during my childhood. When my children get a fever, I know which herbs I should give to them. I have baskets of herbs plants around my house. I know also very well when to bring them to the hospital.

Why is there no translation of the words said by the wizard in the film?

Most of those words from the shaman I didn’t understand either. It’s not the language of our world. Only shamans, people who spend their time to learn and communicate with the spiritual world, understand what the words mean.